Persistent World Griefers

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               

shadowsallaround wrote...

Go ahead and do it.  Then you also understand the consequences of dms abuse and allowing players of their friends to do so for an orgy of abuse fun that a lot of you dms do.  That is what made me your monster in the first place.  Oh yeah, the banning aspect with no legitimately reason as well.  Give it your best shot you tootsie wootie.

best way to get rid of griefers, player password your server. 
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Fergoose]

               As a little addition, it may be worth making your thoughts known to some of the moderators here if you see similar language to that alluded to above on the forums. The example so kindly provided by shadowsallaround in the link below was quickly edited by them, but thanks to the power of Google can still be viewed. If you find such conduct offensive, it may be worth flagging it with a moderator. Hopefully when a critical mass of offensive and mindless posting is reported, a ban may be considered.

warning, this is a link to a post that may be considered offensive
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Fergoose, 15 octobre 2011 - 10:02 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_ffbj]

               I don't If I really buy that argument about the bad actions of dm's creating a Frankenstein. I suppose some dm somewhere did something to you that was unfair, but does that mean you have the justification to plague other innocent individuals with your actions? Apparently so in your mind. This excuse for bad behavior is one often used by criminals and other socio-paths to warrent their anti-scocial actions. It's a specious argument. That was for ssallaround.
And I see you can actually write with some coherence instead of your usual 'me thinky that'..or whatever that mismash attempt at presenting some alternate persona is. I will admit though it is rather amusing, but then I am rather easily amused.
Btw I have played on a lot of servers and never recieved a harsh word from a dm, quite the contrary.  Though I have been mistreated on ocassion by dm's I just blow it off, no big deal.  People want to have fun and if your idea of fun is to spoil others fun, then that is going to get you a bad reputation and then all that follows will only serve to enhance your persecusion complex, causing you to become more obnoxious, resulting in life time bans, etc... that you fell you did not deserve.  But you really do deseve them because of what you did previously.  Anyway if you were not banned is there any guarantee that you would not behave badly in the future?  I think not, according to your history.  Maybe you are just upset with the bans because they are preventing you from being even more of a drag for others.  So instead you come here, and act badly.  At least that my relatively cursory analysis of the situation.  I suppose for some negative attention is better than no attention at all.
I guess that makes me a poopoos head.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par ffbj, 10 octobre 2011 - 11:30 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_shadowsallaround]

               You are right except for the part of me doing it on purpose for the thrill of it.  I have experienced harsh treatment back in the earlier days of these servers and it has led me to be relentless.  In the real world you all would be surprised at how I really am.  In that real world out there, I truly treat people the way I would want to be treated.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               As an outside observer, all I can say, if the posting by Shadowsallaround is any indication of the level of what can be expected by him/her in game, I certainly would not invite him/her to my PW. While it is true there is a level of anonymity online, you still only get one chance at a first impression. When you add in the complaints about the behavior, from multiple admins, of various PWs, I can see why Shadowsallaround is probably being blanket banned from many PWs, whether he/she has logged into them or not.
Logging into a online game in NWN is not a right. You did not pay any fee to warrant that kind of mindset. You are logging into someone else's game. They spent months, if not years, making it into the place it is. They get to choose what happens there, not you. Be respectful, or get shown the door. If you do not like, or can't understand that, I suggest you use the same manners that you should use when you walk into someone else's home. I am sure the outbursts of inappropriate garbage that has been linked to you would find you unwelcome anywhere, not just in NWN.
If after all of that you still can't handle how some choose to admin their game, you can of course make and host your own. I doubt anyone would want to log into it, but you might get some one of your ilk to join.

good luck to you.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_shadowsallaround]

               Aye....you past the test.  Now you all can unban me.  Perhaps even some of those servers that I would donate to per month that would cost the same as wow membership.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               I believe that you will find, that when you earn a ban, its forever. No one has time to deal with trouble makers, let alone spend time unbanning them after they were so distracting the first time. like I posted, you get one shot at a first impression, and from the look of things, you ruined your chances of being taken serious at the PWs you visited, or those PWs that communicate with them.
Multiple PW admins do communicate with each other, and share who is worthy of being banned before they log in. They even share the security to keep them out. Some of this communities top scripters have made the code available to every PW experiencing a problem with griefers, or are looking to stop problems before they happen. This PW admin group shares not only the log in, CD-key, and IP of the griefer, but also the type of griefing done, and what was done to make them go away forever.
Perhaps in the future, you will behave like a respectable player, and not the way you have been banned for.
Good luck to you.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Dismus]

               On the server I am on we have unbanned players after a period of time and after they have spoken to admin.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_ffbj]

               I for one believe in second chances although I certainly concur with SHOVA's points about first impressions.  Sometimes I think it is good to try to see things from another's point of view.  In this case server admins who ban players based on reports from other servers.  Their thinking may be that I should not allow this guy/gal in even on the chance that he/she will misbehave based on past behaviors.  In other words it's just not worth the angst it may cause.
It's a sad but true fact that it is much more difficult to regain a lost reputation, than it is to establish  one.  For instance  a person steals something and they get the reputation of being a thief, even though they only stole something one time.  Or cheated, or lied, etc...
So that person becomes a thief, a cheater, or a liar, even though it was possibly only a momentary lapse and not truely the major part of that persons character.  Personally I think this relates to our shared tribal ancestry where certain actions were branded a certain way and members of the community shunned that member who exibited those behaviors, as a way of protecting the community overall from ani-social behaviors and at the same time sending a message to other tribal/community members to avoid those behaviors.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               While some may like to give a second chance or whatnot, I think the latest round of grief play, has turned the admin community against dealing with it. The list of what player causes problems, has been growing for months. it is now easier for any PW admin to access that list, receive help in the coding set up to block that type of player, and to move on, and have a great time playing NWN. That's the main thing we are talking about here, There are a few players who, only bring annoyance, poor manners, and down right c_rap, to everyone else they come into contact with, once they log in. I certainly do not enjoy "teaching others how to act" nor do I believe I should have to. I know how to behave, play nice, be respectful, and follow whatever rule is set in place by the one hosting. I either agree to those rules, or I log out of that world. Simple, non interfering for those who do want to play there. The idea that anyone should get hand held because they act poor, or allowed back after being an idiot, is simply idiotic. As a parent, When my child acts in appropriately, there are consequences. Sometimes, depending on the action, those consequences are that something is not allowed, available, or usable, anymore. My children, now old enough to have learned that, do not act like they are idiots. They certainly do not disrupt others to get their way, and they certainly would never behave as if there are no consequences for their actions, whether in the real world, or online.

The simple truth, however skewed from my perspective is this, the average age of the people who play NWN, is 30+ that means that the griefers are probably old enough to know better, before they start acting like they don't have any manners. Now, I am sure we have all met idiots out in the real world, the question is, do you still hang around them, or do you avoid them? Do you invite them into your home? Would you invite them back into your home after they had made everyone in your home frustrated, annoyed, angry, and best of all, wanting to leave to get away from them? If you answered No, then why would you waste time asking them back into a game that is suppose to be fun? That makes no sense at all.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_shadowsallaround]

               Shova? You are indeed correct and sometimes we do need ban because we make silly billies, but forever?
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               try walking into a store and spewing the same things your linked posts say. See if you are not thrown out, and never allowed back. In some countries, and even cities in the USA, you would be arrested for disturbing the peace, let alone held for a psych evaluation. Why would anyone want to deal with anyone who spouts disruptive crap? Why remove the ban from them, when they have already shown they can't play nice.  Had you done that on my PW, it would have resulted in an instant ban, as well as a complaint to your IP. Because of the last griefer storm that came through NWN online play a few months ago, I have already banned you from mine, the complaint by another admin, and the linked rantings was more than enough reason . There is no way I would put up with that level of disrespect from anyone, let alone expose my players to it. So in answer your question, yes forever.
Good luck with your future play.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_shadowsallaround]

               I don't have good people skills.  I also drink a lot.  I do feel depressed to.  Never do I mean to hurt you or others.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_kalbaern]

               

ffbj wrote...

I for one believe in second chances although I certainly concur with SHOVA's points about first impressions. Sometimes I think it is good to try to see things from another's point of view. In this case server admins who ban players based on reports from other servers. Their thinking may be that I should not allow this guy/gal in even on the chance that he/she will misbehave based on past behaviors. In other words it's just not worth the angst it may cause.
It's a sad but true fact that it is much more difficult to regain a lost reputation, than it is to establish one. For instance a person steals something and they get the reputation of being a thief, even though they only stole something one time. Or cheated, or lied, etc...
So that person becomes a thief, a cheater, or a liar, even though it was possibly only a momentary lapse and not truely the major part of that persons character. Personally I think this relates to our shared tribal ancestry where certain actions were branded a certain way and members of the community shunned that member who exibited those behaviors, as a way of protecting the community overall from ani-social behaviors and at the same time sending a message to other tribal/community members to avoid those behaviors.

As part of the "group" that shares information with other PWs I'd like to point out that only verified griefers are banned en masse by us. If a player has a dispute with fellow players, DMs or an Admin on one PW, they aren't likely going to be banned automatically elsewhere for that. We all realise that often personalities clash and that a player that gets banned by one or more PWs can still likely find a nice home somewhere else where temperments and play styles better suit them. In the case of "shadowsallaround", he's certainly met that criteria on several PWs and earned bans on them.
 
He's also met our group's general definition of "griefing" as well. You don't need to just login and PK folk and logout to be a griefer. Anything that disrupts the  playing of others can qualify. So when he's logged in to servers allowing shouts and set forth his streams of innane babbling until a DM boots him, he was griefing. When his PCs show up in a "starting town" and run around naked swinging an axe and spewing babble and random obscenities, he's griefing. That he does this on any server he can get on, sets it as a pattern and eventually ... many of us will or have banned him preemptively. In most cases, DMs on several PWs have even first tried to talk to him and pointed him to their Rules of Play and explained or attempted to explain the "whys" and "why nots" of things there only to be met with him ignoring them and continueing his disruptions aimed towards players at large. His arguements against DMs in general are specious as he seeks to disrupt other players directly. How does targetting fellow players remedy his supposed past wrongs done by DMs elsewhere anyhow? It doesn't. One reaps what they sow and "shadowsallaround" is now sowing a bumper crop of obscurity for his actions.

Hopefully, he'll take the advice of others here and find a place where he's not yet known and login to play and enjoy the world. Somehow I doubt he will.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par kalbaern, 12 octobre 2011 - 07:51 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               

shadowsallaround wrote...

I don't have good people skills.  I also drink a lot.  I do feel depressed to.  Never do I mean to hurt you or others.

You, like everyone else, are responsible for your own actions, your own speech, and how you treat others. If you drink to much, then do not log in, just as you shouldn't drive while drunk. If your people skills are a problem, try listening to others and acting within what they say, especially a DM. Most PWs are nice enough to post the rules to play on them where you first log into them, Try reading them before you do anything else. If you have depression, seek help from a professional. Whatever your intention was, and it is hard to justify that it was not meant to hurt anyone, It was taken as a problem worth banning for. Obviously it was taken that way on more than one PW. Try changing how you play, you might enjoy the game more, and you might be allowed to remain on more PWs. However, on mine, you are not welcome. You probably have been banned forever from others too, I can not speak for them.