Author Topic: Is it still worth it to build?  (Read 1216 times)

Legacy_EzRemake

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Is it still worth it to build?
« on: February 05, 2011, 08:36:47 pm »


               I've been playing DDO recently (Dungeons and Dragons online) and all it's done is made me want to start building in NWN again. However I've noticed there's usually only about 1200 people online during peak hours, and I know many people have their home servers, so I'm wondering if It would even be worth the time?

I have experience building, and can have access to a dedicated server machine if I so choose, but would all the effort be for nothing? I'm not expecting 20 people logged onto the server 24/7, but having a nice player base would be cool.

I'm looking to make an action oriented module, medium magic, that doesn't stray too far from the balance of the original NWN game (in terms of items).

Also, I have alot of free time on my hands as of now, so time is a non-issue really.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_TSMDude

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2011, 10:53:31 pm »


               If you build it for you of course it is.



A better idea though would be to join one of the servers looking for Staff and help there. There is a lot of servers that would welcome new energy.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Shadooow

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2011, 11:19:04 pm »


               Its surely worth at least in the way that you will learn something and you spend that free time with something that you enjoy.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Greyfort

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2011, 11:25:19 pm »


               I would say make it, enjoy doing it, and most of all you can always use any knowlage you gain to help others.  As some of us here are old programers and nwn has been a fun program to program. Others are not programers but have learned how to from nwn.  So YES ITS WORTH IT.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_EzRemake

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2011, 11:52:09 pm »


               Also, the new Neverwinter game is expected this year is it not? I suppose getting some practice in for that wouldn't be a waste.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_FelSeero

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2011, 03:17:47 am »


               If you truly enjoy doing it then by all means. I've been building my server in the last few years and I've only seen maybe a handful of new players in the last month. I'm still hopeful but its more the fact that its there for anyone who wants to play.
               
               

               
            

Baaleos

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2011, 10:18:20 am »


               Nwnscript is a very good starting language, which can lead to having knowledge of c# etc.



So, from a coding point of view, it can be useful for professional career's too.

If you enjoy it as well, then all the better.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_SuperFly_2000

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2011, 12:32:52 pm »


               Your question is probably quite common amongst many NWN players including myself.

The frustration of that there is no other game that is good and also too some extent the lack of a PW that fits you / me exactly.

Your project sounds pretty interesting I must say. I have been thinking about something similar myself. Especially I am interested in making something somewhat close to the original NWN...even though some things will have to be adjusted naturally...

As many pointed out here if you get some kind of satisfaction from it yourself....as building can be fun in itself...and then also playing your own module...hopefully with some friends at least...

The lookout to get some friends at least I don't know...I am seeing many servers struggling to even have some players on at all times...especially euro times.

Makes me try to think about other servers but many have taken roleplaying way to far...for me roleplaying is not a means to an end....it is something you do along the way....this is what most RP PW's nowdays don't get properly...yes...call it hack'n slash..call it what you want...but I call it RP and action and that is the way I want to play.

Also as you mentioned yourself I guess the new Neverwinter game will be out this year hopefully. Even though this is a game that finally sounds interesting there is still a risk that it will fall in the general pit of games for masses of kidz....so it is not a guarantee really.


The time consumption to build a relative small to medium sized PW module for NWN1 is however staggering. At least the way I would like to do it. Just the playtesting is staggering. I don't want to put something half-polished out there...which will probably be the result anyway. It is not easy to get a 5 man testing crew to work for you 5 weeks for free....or even payed. Well some PW's players would actually agree that seeing a small bug here and there is not a biggie....but still I would have to run around my own module like 2-3 times just to make sure at least the most important systems and other are in place and working....

If the NWN toolset was even easier and faster to work with AND if it had most of the options and settings necessary for a PW already built in there it would be better....this is still another thing that kind of leads me to want to wait for the new Neverwinter game. Then we will finally be rid of all the SP thinking that was built into the game and the toolset...


I have no good advice really. It is your choice. If you got the time...sure...I mean..why not...

I am thinking about at least getting started...see where it leads...


Although there are many PW's....that could use some help...both player and admin wise. Many of them are still to rigid to want to accomodate my playing style there...so I don't know....
               
               

               
            

Legacy_EzRemake

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2011, 06:50:45 am »


               Well, I've been building, and after getting all the base framework down, I'm starting to have a lot of fun, even playing my own mod! I just have to make sure I don't build and play too too much, so that I don't get bored '<img'>

If anyone wants to come check out what I've done so far, see what the concept is and such, you can come take a look at [99.236.161.203:5121 - Ez's Upcomming 2011 Module], i'll be leaving the server up for 12 hours or so for anyone interested.

Any comments and suggestions would be awesome, I'm looking to make a very lengthy dungeon crawler type.

(Hint: Damage reduction is crucial early game)
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Drewskie

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2011, 01:38:50 am »


               

I've been playing DDO recently (Dungeons and Dragons online) and all it's done is made me want to start building in NWN again.




Same with me and WoW.  Wow, the game where don't need arrows for your bow(unlimited ammo by defualt), no attempt is made to differentiate damage types such as bludgeoning/slashing, and enemies you would expect be immune to certain attacks (ie fire elements and fire) aren't immune at all.  Design decisions made so as to not confuse and frustrate all the twitch kiddies out there.  Though I had some fun I'm about done with wow.



Just build, I'm sure people will continue to support NWN as there's nothing else like it... not even close.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Magical Master

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2011, 07:40:29 pm »


               Drewskie, it has nothing to do with confusing or frustrating "twitch kiddies."  There are two questions:

1. Does including it serve a legitimate purpose?

2.  Does it screw up balance?

Regarding arrows, WoW actually had arrows/bullets that were used until a few months ago.  All it did was force Hunters to constantly buy massive amounts of ammunition that ate up storage space.  In other words, it had no impact on balance and was merely a convenience thing, so removing it improved quality of life.

Regarding damage, things did use to be immune (elementals were immune to Bleed effects, for example).  Guess what happened?  Any class that used a lot of Bleeds was not allowed in groups that were fighting elementals because they were sub-par.  Having people refuse to bring you to a dungeon because you were going to drag the group down was not a fun game experience and all it did was encourage class stacking (bringing a lot of a certain class because they were extremely good on a fight).  Aka, the net effect was no different (you simply wouldn't let some people come along and got extra of the good classes) and it excluded people not because they were bad players, but because they happened to be the wrong class.

Blizzard learned from their mistakes.
               
               

               


                     Modifié par Magical Master, 12 février 2011 - 08:31 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_Drewskie

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2011, 07:59:22 pm »


               Dumbed down game play is all it is. Is too much to ask for players to keep track of such things? I dunno...if I'm an archer a stock of arrows will be pretty high on my priority list. Not to mention different ammo types can give effects, like the fire, ice, etc arrows of NWN. You can take things too far, like food rations for resting in old school hcr, or wow's soul shards which were removed, but I don't think bows and arrows crosses that line.

Wow is a huge world... If i'm a fire mage I should be avoiding the flame lizard area, or dual speccing to ice so I can go in and contribute. Dual speccing is dirt cheap too now, btw, so it should be easy for players to change and adapt.
               
               

               


                     Modifié par Drewskie, 12 février 2011 - 08:01 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_Magical Master

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2011, 10:11:49 pm »


               I think the better question is why should players have to keep track of such things at all.

Ever played Legend of Zelda (at least Ocarina of Time or Majora's Mask)?  In the game you have a bow with a limited number of arrows and you had to collect more.  But part of the gameplay was that you couldn't waste arrows in hard combat or you'd run out.  Couldn't constantly miss or use them on enemies that weren't worth it.  In WoW and NWN, an archer running out of arrows is the equivalent of a giant sign saying "I AM AN IDIOT."  Conserving arrows is not a part of the gameplay.  You buy thousands of arrows that can last for days (note: real life archers did not carry thousands or even hundreds of arrows).  Since it's not intended to be a limited resource, having to keep track of it adds nothing.

But what about the different ammo types?  That's a fair point...except that WoW has a different take on it.  Instead of doing nothing but carrying around stacks of different types of arrows, the hunter uses their magic to do special attacks (like an Arcane Archer's Imbue Arrow).  This also results in active, *non-dumbed down* gameplay.

In NWN, as an archer you can activate Rapid Shot and if the target has low discipline use Called Shot (with a horrible UI making this difficult)...but for the most part, you just left click on the target and sit back to watch.  Maybe you occasionally drink a potion or something, but that's about it (if you're going to try to bring up kiting or something similar, then we can include WoW's kiting as well).  Aka, to play an archer for the most part follow these steps: 1, activate Rapid Shot.  2, left click on target.  3, Profit

Stats are also pretty simple as well.  You have Dexterity which increases AB, Strength which can increase damage with Mighty, and different strengths of enchantments on bows.

Then let's look at WoW.  I think the easiest way to make my point is to read http://elitistjerks....]_marksmanship/

That's for 1 out of 3 Hunter specializations alone.  If you think WoW has dumbed down game-play, then I think you haven't ever done heroic dungeons or raids and are just leveling or doing normal dungeons (hint: I don't know of sites in NWN that make 10 minute videos carefully going over the tactics needed to defeat just *one* boss).

Regarding huge world and Dual-Spec, did you know Dual-Spec didn't even exist until Wrath of the Lich King?  I'm surprised you don't consider *that* dumbed down gameplay or something.

I am curious about your experience in the game since I think that is coloring your conclusions.  Imagine a rogue using poisons, for example.  If you made a poison immune mob, there's no alternative for the rogue.  Or if you say "Here, we'll give you a Sharpening Stone that adds the same amount of damage!" then why would you bother making it poison immune in the first place?
               
               

               


                     Modifié par Magical Master, 12 février 2011 - 11:15 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_TSMDude

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #13 on: February 12, 2011, 10:46:18 pm »


               If you guys want to discuss WoW then do so somewhere else. Most of us here could care less for WoW and only play when we want to play a first person shooter game based on a fantasy setting.



I could care less about dual spec or any of that crap so go find a WoW board please.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Magical Master

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Is it still worth it to build?
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2011, 11:19:29 pm »


               1, I tried out the module the original poster made and sent him a PM with feedback.  Did you do that?



2, what we're talking about has plenty of relevance to NWN.  Whether red dragons should be fire immune, elementals poison immune, undead critical strike immune, etc, are factors in NWN design as well.  Builders have the option to change any of these or even do crazy things like making all bows have unlimited ammo.



3, where did "first person shooter" come from?



4, no one is forcing you to read this regardless.