Do Haks stop people from coming to a server?

[Legacy_Kail Pendragon]

               

ehye_khandee wrote...

Kail Pendragon wrote...

ehye_khandee wrote...

Kail,
I find it amazing that you fail to either read my post or comprehend the words.[

I will try one more time, then resolve that you are just impish or unable to comprehend.

ALL of NWN players - can join a server with no haks. CAN is the operative word.

Wrong. Can is not the operative word. The operative words are "are willing to".

This is without merit. You are AGAIN putting words into my post which I did not type.

I am not. I'm putting words in my post, not yours. It's me to say willing to and for a reason. It doesn't matter at all who can join the server, it matters who will join the server. Anybody that gets information about NWN can play it provided they take the necessary steps of getting a copy of the game, no mater whether we are talking about a hak-ed or hak-free PW or whatever. The issue is, will they play it or not?

I stated what I stated and you took it utterly wrong as you always have.

And rightly so since your statements are wrong once again (and as usual... no surprise there for me).

Read what I said, and post your counterclaim actually addressing the point I made and we'll have a dialog.

Do not delude yourself, I'm not interested in having a dialog with someone of your level of intelligence. You are not worth it.

Up until now, you are simply wrong, utterly wrong and fully wrongheaded.

Prove it then. Oh, I forgot, you can't, so you ar eleft with empty claims and unfounded "reasoning".

I repeat - my original statement here for those unable or unwilling to read the original :

It is 100% logical that since a server that does not use haks can be joined by ALL of the NWN audience and servers WITH a hak requirement can only be joined by a SOME of the NWN audience,

False. All PWs can be joined by all the NWN audience. Hak-ed PWs simply require the extra step of downloading the necessary haks.

that having hak requirments DOES limit who can join.

Having a hak limits those that will join not those who can join. Besides also not having a hak limits the pool of players for the server since there are those who will not join any PW which is hak free

Making your hak requirements more managable by linking to them from your forums, wiki, web, blog, etc. makes it more likely that those who are lacking your haks may download them and thus be able to join the server.

Which says nothing about the pool of players of hak-free and hak-ed PWs.

All this said, there are still a portion of the NWN audience who are purists and will not even consider downloading a hak.

And similarly there is a portion of NWN players who will never consider to play a hak-free PW. Most of them are possibly spoiled by the quality and amount of custom content available and by the endless possibilities granted by this custom content that they look down on hak free PWs as not worth the effort of checking out.

In fact we could very well ask whether "does the absence of haks stop people from coming to a server?". It does stop some, as a matter of fact.

So both choices, adding a hak and not adding a hak stop people from joining a server.

Now, Kail, if you will get someone to read the page for you, you will see it is ONLY YOU who are positing 'willingness' I stated only 'can join' and I stand by that utter truth.

Any PW can be joined by any NWN player, no matter whether it' s a hak-free or hak-ed PW. So your utter truth is simply unfounded as usual.

Should you be reminded of this other utter truth:

Sorry to be a downer but it stands to reason, if your 'draw' (percentage
of viewers who take your offer) is pitched to a smaller group, you will
get less total takers. This assumes you have the same level of appeal
with the module and pitch. The groups outlined in my other post
indicated that the smaller group are those 'amenable to haks' vs the
whole group of nwners which is the larger group. Pitched against these
two groups the larger group should provide a greater response, all else
being equal. It's just numbers.

Your "numbers" are wrong. I'll let you figure out why. I know you won't.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               There is a limit to how many players can join a server, therefore not everyone can log in to a server if they use haks or not. personaly, I will not join a Hakless PW. I will not join a CEP only PW, as CEP, while a great HAK set, feels to me rather generic on what CC is available. Argueing about the semantics of who can, or will join is pointless, because your trying to quantify people. Currently there are only a handfull of servers running now, with players logged in. From a sampling of active player PWs, only 3 did not use haks. I did not look at every server running, with players. The probability that a new PW, or even an established Empty PW atracting players lately has been, and probably will remain, slim to none. I am sure that some may believe differently, but the truth is, NWN is a old game, and has been in decline for awhile now, and most, Thats most, not all, players ted to stay with the PW they know. To the OP, my advice is to add haks, overrides or whetever CC you like, think is neat, or inspires you to build.

Good luck!
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Lightfoot8]

               Most of the long time players will have little problem downloading a hak to play on a server,After all by now they are use to it.  However with the recent ability to directly download NWN from sites like GOG, there may be a new influx of players that have no idea what a hak even is. Some of thies players may not bother to download haks, untill after they play a PW without a hak.  Once they have been bitten by a good PW the chances are better that they will download haks to play a server.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Fellanor]

               If you have a lot of players already, haks won't harm you. If you're a small server with 0 players on, having a lot of haks could stop some players from bothering to check you out.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_cmwise]

               As a player who has experience in making and down loading Haks, erf's, mods, etc. I dont mind doing it now. But two years ago, no way..and by the way...different PW's use different methods for down loading Haks...that is really where the difference comes into play...If you want to have the player download three or four separate haks from third party sources, and then go onto the vault to download two or three more (of massive size) and then extract manually to where?  Then, manually place in proper directories, clean up any override problems..well..some folks just wont go through it all.

There are some PW's with simple set up wizards that can walk the player through the down loads, that is helpful.

Point is this, if you have to be a computer nerd to get the Haks in place to play..people wont do it. They'll get lost in the process or not even try.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par cmwise, 19 mars 2011 - 01:09 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Eagles Talon]

               Kalbaern wrote:

- NWN seems to have a wider age spread than many other online games. Many of the "older" players I know are often afraid of haks. Just loading and updating to 1.69 is often enough to give them an anxiety attack. '> Many older folks do prefer a hakless PW.

- Many folk regardless of age (though rarely under 30) fear that a simple misclick installing a hak will end the world, launch a virus to wipe out their computers or somehow make some guy in Nigeria able to empty their checking accounts. These of course also prefer a hakless PW.

Thank you sir for making me realize that I am an exception to the rule.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_TSMDude]

               Just letting everyone know we have decided to use haks now and will let you all know how it does for our numbers.

We of course will be ready to roll back if it seriously effects other folks but I am thinking it will actually enhance rather than push people away.

Anyone have any new thoughts on this?
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Arinoch]

               I think NWN was released almost 10 years ago, and the aversion to downloading even the 1 gig CEP has got to be a lot more limited now. Just thinking of my own internet connection, only probably 3 years ago my absolute max download speed was 100k/sec from a really good site? Now it's 600-700k/sec. So whereas previously it took 2.5 hours to download 1 gig, now it can take maybe 25 minutes on a good site.

When I started playing on PWs I went for one that had zero haks for simplicity's sake because I was just testing the waters of NWN PWs. I can't imagine many brand new NWN players diving head first from the 10 meter diving board downloading 2 gigs worth of haks (server haks + CEP) just to try something they may not like. That said, how many new NWN players are there at this point? Now you have people with experience looking for a server that will suit their specific wants as a player. I play on one that has CEP and its own install and launcher. It isn't someone seeing if they want to swim in the world of PWs anymore; it's someone who's tested several different pools and has decided they like their water 23.6 meters deep with dyed, slightly purple water and 0.07% chlorine. The brand new NWN player at this point is going to be rare.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_seventhslayer]

               it really is a slog...when you switch over and try to find a server that you might be comfortable in, it really is a bit obnoxious, ESPECIALLY for new players trying to get into the game. It's annoying enough having to make new character's for each server you try, let alone downloading all the hakpaks and etc that come with it.

I mean atm I wouldn't be bothering with Planar Legends' 1 gig of hakpaks if 1. it wasn't new and 2. there are a considerable amount of people on there and I'm tired of logging into PW's with 0 players in them.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Fellanor]

               CEP stops me coming to a server, because it's such a hunk of junk.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Metaldwarf]

               

Fellanor wrote...

CEP stops me coming to a server, because it's such a hunk of junk.

LOL...can you clarify what you mean by calling one of the most important things to come out of the hard work of dozens of dedicated NWN crafters a 'hunk of junk'? I had nothing to do with it but to this day my primary gaming experience is NWN due to the work and the love the community has for continuing to improve it.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Mad.Hatter]

               The only problem with CEP is that it started to add things (looking at scripts, CRAP, so on) that most of the community doesn't and wouldn't use. Hence the complaints of bloat. (I still use it, though)
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_PurpleDragonKnight]

               Haks do prevent me from trying a server, especially the CEP. I have a low graphics card, and most haks were poorly done. Sure, they look pretty, but they lacked the design efficiency, practicality and server load parameters of Bioware's work. So many examples of it - CEP fog, which lags everything up... Custom trees, which create invisible barriers so that you can't walk around them. There are very few haks which were expertly done.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Fellanor]

               Metaldwarf:

The CEP clogs up the palette with mostly junk. It triples module loading times. Most of its placables are poorly constructed. Remember, that it is a jumble of different works. Personally, I find that 95% of it is worthless. Am I going to add it to my module for that 5% which is decent? Nope. The bigger it grows, the more useless it becomes. It actually makes it harder for a builder to find the good stuff, because it clogs the palettes up with an unnecessarily massive amount of repetitive content.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Fellanor]

               PurpleDragonKnight:

That is a fair comment. A lot of players like to whine about Bioware (while playing their game), but Bioware, to be fair, did put a high level of planning into their content. That is why there is not a huge quantity of it available; Because they actually thought about all the aspects: As you say, design efficiency, module strain, etc.

CEP objects, on the other hand, appear to have been construced much faster and with a large number of imperfections. Add all of them together and you get... a hunk of junk.