Beholder antimagic cone?

[Legacy_Snottling]

               It's already set, Funky. But thanks anyway. '>

Yes, I imported the ray.erf to the module, but seeing that the cone rarely fires in a standard Environment, I Think we can rule out Q-Necron's rays as the culprit and simply accept how it is now. - Rare antimagic cones.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Shadooow]

               you wrote:

FunkySwerve wrote...

Make sure you're using x2 ai. It's the ai that immplemented the beholder special scripts, iirc. Older ai doesn't handle them.

Funky

So I understood it that you want to advice the OP to use the x2_def_* script set. I cant see another way to interpretation since you mentioned the "old AI" doesnt handle the special scripts. That is not true and while beholders by default have x2_def_ script set, it is not needed and actually I would recommend to everyone get rid of the x2_def scripts from all monsters since they just eat more instructions for almost no extra features.

To the OP: if you are willing to test my unofficial patch it improves and corrects beholders AI a lot. Since you claim to have no overrides and made new module I guess that what you see is simply standard behavior.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WhiZard]

               Rare?  I can get them going quite often.  If your not buffing yourself with things to dispel, the AI is not going to reciprocate with an anti-magic cone.  The technical details of how this specific AI works are posted on the wiki.  Read this so you know what is intended, instead of continually claiming that it is broken.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Snottling]

               Well, I had a level 18 sorcerer fully buffed running around casting AoE spells. I am merely stating what I saw - one cone for two hours.
I was just wondering if it was a known issue. '>
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WhiZard]

               And did you rebuff after you were stripped?
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_FunkySwerve]

               

Snottling wrote...

It's already set, Funky. But thanks anyway. '>

Yes, I imported the ray.erf to the module, but seeing that the cone rarely fires in a standard Environment, I Think we can rule out Q-Necron's rays as the culprit and simply accept how it is now. - Rare antimagic cones.

Next up, try setting this variable up to 100, if it isn't:

X2_L_BEH_MAGIC

(int)

Lower values make the ai more prone to do things other than using magic, as you might guess from the name.

Funky
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_FunkySwerve]

               

ShaDoOoW wrote...

you wrote:

FunkySwerve wrote...

Make sure you're using x2 ai. It's the ai that immplemented the beholder special scripts, iirc. Older ai doesn't handle them.

Funky

So I understood it that you want to advice the OP to use the x2_def_* script set. I cant see another way to interpretation since you mentioned the "old AI" doesnt handle the special scripts.

Then I'll chalk it up to difficulty with language on your part, or ambiguity on mine. I just wanted to make sure he had the special ai set to fire, per my above post. My assumption, though I didn't bother to check, as I'm trying to help someone, not writing a dissertation, is that nw_ ai doesn't check those vars. I know for a fact it didn't at one point, but it didn't matter for the advice I was giving. That's why I said 'older' ai, rather than specifying a particular ai - a lot of mods, like HG, have legacy code modifying the scripts away from vanilla, so even if the various nw ais were updated to check for x2 vars when x2 was released, it wouldn't matter. Again, none of that seems terribly relevant to the OP's issue, so I didn't bother posting it. In the future, if you try a little harder to read my posts in a context that makes sense, you'd likely save us both some time.

Further, what you say about x2 ai isn't true. It's a marked improvement over older ai and even a lot of custom ais. We ran some pretty extesive tests before settling on one to modify, and it was considerably 'meaner' than either nw_ ais or j_ai (Jasperre's, with either one or two 'r's, I can never remember, post compile-fixes). Again, though, we have a couple legacy scripts modded way back when, so your milage may vary.

Funky
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WhiZard]

               

FunkySwerve wrote...

Snottling wrote...

It's already set, Funky. But thanks anyway. '>

Yes, I imported the ray.erf to the module, but seeing that the cone rarely fires in a standard Environment, I Think we can rule out Q-Necron's rays as the culprit and simply accept how it is now. - Rare antimagic cones.

Next up, try setting this variable up to 100, if it isn't:

X2_L_BEH_MAGIC

(int)

Lower values make the ai more prone to do things other than using magic, as you might guess from the name.

Funky

Given the OPs rarity (once in two hours) and that a deficiency in eye rays was not mentioned, I doubt this is the case.  What I think the OP is experiencing is eye ray attacks without the antimagic cone.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Shadooow]

               

FunkySwerve wrote...

Next up, try setting this variable up to 100, if it isn't:

X2_L_BEH_MAGIC

(int)

since beholders use special AI script this variable is not used, it is used only when creature runs standard AI script

As for your suggestion, I read that carefully, your advice was useless and what you said was incorrect and could cause confusion not to mention wasted time. Legacy includes? Seriously you are trying to mask your wrong suggestion to this? I don't think OP module uses modified scripts from version 1.23 but hey lets ask him.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_MagicalMaster]

               FWIW, Funky, I also took your post to mean "use the x2_def_* stuff because it's needed to make the stuff work."  And, by default, the x2_def_* files pretty much just call another script.

Now the scripts called by x2_def_* are likely leaner and meaner, but you can easily eliminate x2_def_* scripts.

That said, ShaDoOoW, his point about making sure that the actual beholder AI was getting called was quite relevant, even if he could have been far clearer.  Older mods may be running the original AI scripts rather than the updated ones which don't call the special creature stuff.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Snottling]

               Yes, of course I rebuffed when stripped of magic.
And yes, the eye rays are working fine, it's just the cone that rarely fires.

That being said, my son came home and did a workaround on the module with Q-Necron's rays, so the cones now fire every d4 rounds if there's something to dispel. Don't ask me how he did it, because I have no idea and am rather useless when it comes to scripting.

I'm a pretty happy beholder fan right now '>

And thanks to every poster. I appreciate your help. '>
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Shadooow]

               

MagicalMaster wrote...

That said, ShaDoOoW, his point about making sure that the actual beholder AI was getting called was quite relevant, even if he could have been far clearer.  Older mods may be running the original AI scripts rather than the updated ones which don't call the special creature stuff.

Well if this would be that rare case that module was created pre expansions and module author modified nw_c2_ scripts and nw_i0_generic include, x2_def_ script set would not helped to run the special ai script anyway. There was just nothing more than executing original scripts in x2_ai_ thorought nwn official version history, i checked that. So no it wasn't relevant since even if there was old scripts in module actual script set wouldn't and doesn't matter.

Anyway, closer look to their special AI revealed that they should work merely the same even without special AI. Their special AI script just allows them to teleport when they have low hitpoints etc. which was used in HotU campaign I think and some more goodies of course, but they can use their attack even without this.

They can fire dispell cone everytime when they make their ray attack. As long as its not beholder mage it should fire the first time beholder uses rays against fully buffed sorcerer.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par ShaDoOoW, 16 novembre 2013 - 07:38 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_MagicalMaster]

               Actually, I was thinking more of a module that renamed the original AI scripts when editing them.  Which means x2 would call the proper AI.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_FunkySwerve]

               

MagicalMaster wrote...
That said, ShaDoOoW, his point about making sure that the actual beholder AI was getting called was quite relevant, even if he could have been far clearer.  Older mods may be running the original AI scripts rather than the updated ones which don't call the special creature stuff.

I think Shad's a bit more concerned about his e-peen than helping the OP. '> My point was pretty simple, and he's well aware that I've worked extensively on ai, as I've posted code for him in the past. The suggestion, for example, that I'm not aware that x2_ just routes to nw_ ai in most cases, is just silly, as the ai I posted for him was built on x2.

I actually think 'older' ai is about as clearly as I could've put it. I knew it was a potential issue because we had that selfsame issue back in 2005 or so, when I built our beholder hive. Modded versions of pre-hotu ai, shockingly, don't check for post-hotu vars. Crazy, I know. Whatever, OP got his issue resolved.

Funky
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WhiZard]

               

Snottling wrote...

Yes, of course I rebuffed when stripped of magic.
And yes, the eye rays are working fine, it's just the cone that rarely fires.

Last question if you are still there.  You wouldn't happen to have any party members with your sorcerer?  If the sorcerer stays back and fires his spells while a henchman/summon/companion/familiar is closer, the sorcerer will never be a target of an anti-magic cone, though he would be targeted by some (possibly all) of the eye rays.  Since standard summons, familiars, and animal companions rarely meet the qualifications for an antimagic cone to fire, the cone would not be fired.