Polymorphing and Items

[Legacy_henesua]

               I'll check them out, but I have looked at the wildshape spell which also accomplishes item merges.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_FunkySwerve]

               

WhiZard wrote...

FunkySwerve wrote...

In principle, it should work the same with ActionEquipItem, though I'm not sure what poly status will do to that.

That's the tough part.  Polymorph weapons are in the creature weapon slot, not what a standard weapon would normally equip into.  Creature weapons do have the advantage that you can set the base damage (but you can't set the damage type (beyond expanding it by an extra melee damage property) the critical multiplier or the critical threat range).  What you could do is copy the weapon properties over like Bioware did for equipment merges.

You can equip any weapon you like directly to those slots. We do it all the time, to hide inappropriate weapon appearances. The purpose, of course, is to achieve the desired crit range and multiplier, though we originally did it in an attempt to boost abs with WM ab, before acaos wrote an engine hack to artificially raise ab.

The question is not whether or not non-creature slots are available to polymorphed critters, but whether the slots available behave the same as with a normal-nonpoly (I suspect they do).

Funky
               
               

               

                     Modifié par FunkySwerve, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:31 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_WhiZard]

               

FunkySwerve wrote...
The question is not whether or not non-creature slots are available to polymorphed critters, but whether the slots available behave the same as with a normal-nonpoly (I suspect they do).

Are you actually testing this on polymorphed critters?  After one is fully polymorphed, nothing can be equipped into those slots (short of NWNX funcs if they can accomplish this).
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Rolo Kipp]

               <trying to get...>

henesua wrote...
the problem is not the model, but the way polymorph works. My aim is for players that become wererats to use their weapon when in the wererat form. Polymorph however does not allow items to be equiped to the normal equipment slots - only creature weapons.

Ok, so if I poly'd into a male drow (59), which comes equipped with a drow longsword (x2_wdrowls004), the weapon is equipped in my normal weapon slot, but I can not script a swap with another weapon? (Drow is "F" type appearance...)
Frost giant, another poly target that comes equipped is "L" appearance...

If the appearance has an anim type with a hand node and the polymorph type in polymorph.2da lists an equipped item, shouldn't we be able to swap an item (the weapon stored when poly'd, perhaps) with the equipped item and have the weapon appear in hand?

(edit: what is modeltype "FT"? In the appearance.2da for wererat (170)?)

<...a handle on the idea>
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Rolo Kipp, 21 novembre 2011 - 12:38 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Rolo Kipp]

               <blinking in the glare...>

Rolo Kipp wrote...
(edit: what is modeltype "FT"? In the appearance.2da for wererat (170)?)

Omnibus to the rescue: W=wings, T=tail... Got it :-)

<...as the light dawns>
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Rolo Kipp, 21 novembre 2011 - 12:51 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Rolo Kipp]

               <rooting around...>

Ben Harrison wrote (Omnibus)...
In polymorph.2da, enter the resref of an item blueprint in the EQUIPPED column of your polymorph type, and it'll be added to a polymorphed creature's inventory, and equipped automatically.
It's a good idea to make the polymorph type's CreatureWeapon1, CreatureWeapon2, and CreatureWeapon3 columns ****, also, to prevent equipped creature weapons from interfering with attack statistics.

Not precisely what we're looking for, either. But promising ;-)

<...in the cellar>
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Shadooow]

               

WhiZard wrote...

FunkySwerve wrote...
The question is not whether or not non-creature slots are available to polymorphed critters, but whether the slots available behave the same as with a normal-nonpoly (I suspect they do).

Are you actually testing this on polymorphed critters?  After one is fully polymorphed, nothing can be equipped into those slots (short of NWNX funcs if they can accomplish this).

I dodnt understand, so you responded to me its possible and now its not?

Rolo Kipp: I think henesua knows how to work with polymorph.2da, point is that he needs the weapon to be dynamic, while 2da allows to set only one specific and direct value.

A true solution could be a NWNX plugin that can Set2DAString, I think there is one for linux - but its only a theory.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WhiZard]

               

ShaDoOoW wrote...

WhiZard wrote...

FunkySwerve wrote...
The question is not whether or not non-creature slots are available to polymorphed critters, but whether the slots available behave the same as with a normal-nonpoly (I suspect they do).

Are you actually testing this on polymorphed critters?  After one is fully polymorphed, nothing can be equipped into those slots (short of NWNX funcs if they can accomplish this).

I dodnt understand, so you responded to me its possible and now its not?

I have both times described that it does not work for non-creature slots.  Creature slots seem to deal damage as if there was something equipped after I used this command via script.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_FunkySwerve]

               

WhiZard wrote...

FunkySwerve wrote...
The
question is not whether or not non-creature slots are available to
polymorphed critters, but whether the slots available behave the same as
with a normal-nonpoly (I suspect they do).

Are you
actually testing this on polymorphed critters?  After one is fully
polymorphed, nothing can be equipped into those slots (short of NWNX
funcs if they can accomplish this).

No...as I specifically said above, THAT is what I wasn't sure about. And sure enough, testing confirms it. Neither pcs nor npcs can equip a normal dagger (my test item) in either slot 4 or 14 (right hand and lclaw).

ShaDoOoW wrote...

A true solution could be a NWNX plugin that can Set2DAString, I think there is one for linux - but its only a theory.

Vman wrote one, and it works. And yeah, that's about the only option I can think of if you absolutely have to have it go on the fly, instead of editing polymorph.2da.

Funky
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Pstemarie]

               It would have to be on the fly cause what he's trying to do is get a PC polymoprhed into a wererat to use whatever melee weapon the PC was armed with when he changed.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Rolo Kipp]

               <nodding vigorously...>

ShaDoOoW wrote...
Rolo Kipp: I think henesua knows how to work with polymorph.2da, point is that he needs the weapon to be dynamic, while 2da allows to set only one specific and direct value.

A true solution could be a NWNX plugin that can Set2DAString, I think there is one for linux - but its only a theory.

Yup, I *did* realize that, ShadoOow :-) What I'm looking at/for is a way around the limitations...
I mean, besides NwNx, as that also was a parameter of H's question.

At this point I'm wondering what the engine is doing with EffectPolymorph that is blocking equips...
Is it using a completely different object, hence the oPC we all know and love is simply pointing at the wrong thing?
If so, could there be a way to discover the polymorphed object's handle and try equiping that?

I *do* understand that while under the polymorph effect we can not equip items via script (didn't know that before, but I do now). I don't understand *why* (not the reasoning behind it... which I assume is to prevent exploits).

I don't know what the engine is doing that makes a "polymorphed" drow different from an NPC drow. They use the same appearance, with the same animations and the same nodes available, which suggests to me that the engine is using a different object, thereby preserving the original for restoration after the effect is removed. 

It may be that there *is* no way around it, except, perhaps, to set the appearance and manage all the polymorph chores directly instead of using EffectPolymorph. We *do* know *that* is possible. Henesua could set his lycanthrope's appearance to the wererat directly and retain both equipment and spellcasting/scroll use and all those other things that polymorph restricts.

I'd still like to understand *why* polymorph acts the way it does...

<...and making himself dizzy>
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Rolo Kipp, 21 novembre 2011 - 06:53 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_henesua]

               

Rolo Kipp wrote...
It may be that there *is* no way around it, except, perhaps, to set the appearance and manage all the polymorph chores directly instead of using EffectPolymorph. We *do* know *that* is possible. Henesea could set his lycanthrope's appearance to the wererat directly and retain both equipment and spellcasting/scroll use and all those other things that polymorph restricts.

This discussion has basically made it clear to me that if I want to allow a lycanthrope PC to still use equipment, then this is the way I should go.

In the meantime I'm simply not going to allow equipment use for lycanthrope PCs which makes some sense, and saves me the trouble of wrestling with the engine.

First however I am rewritting Fallen's system for lycanthropes. I like the idea of an out of control lycanthrope causing mayhem for PCs that have not yet learned to master the beast. And the out of control lycanthrope will kinda be a clone of the PC but with different appearance, different creature weapons/hide, and its own AI.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Pstemarie]

               NWN Enhanced has a pretty decent system for NPC lycanthropes that you might be able to cannibalize for PCs.