Updated gnolls?

[Legacy_Invisig0th]

               Does anyone out there have any good updates for the Gnoll models or textures? I'm working on a project that will be leveraging most of the updates/reskins of other old school low-level D&D monsters, and these blurry Bioware gnolls look ...rather dated by comparison.

I checked out what is available NWVault first, of course, but everything appears to be at least 8 years old (including all the stuff that was included in CEP). I also looked at Project Q and the HAKs for some of the popular PWs, but I wasn't able to find anything related to gnolls.  At least some of the ongoing PWs must still be using this stock low-level D&D monster on their servers, and I'd have to imagine that *somebody* has taken a stab at bringing this creature up to date relatively recently. Anyone know of anything along these lines?
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Invisig0th, 08 mai 2013 - 01:47 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Master Jax]

               Only update I know was making the manes dynamic, so they moved as hair flowing. Such messed up the shadows of the model, though. Next to that, there's the multicolored and dynamic Gnolls, but I think the original textures were far better than the ones used for those.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Mecheon]

               Gnolls haven't been updated

Personally I've always found the gnolls are pretty good standard, but wouldn't argue with any extra ones
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Invisig0th]

               Since there has been no recent attempt at updating these, would anyone be interested in making a higher quality reskin? Something with more 'fur' and less 'blur'? Something up to Project Q standards would not be required (although I wouldn't say no to it). But anything better than the blurry brown look that we have now would be a substantial  improvement.

For reference:



The armor and the facial features don't look too bad, in my opinion. It's the 'fur' that really drags this one down. Compare and contrast the "fur" with Lordofworms' werewolves, which really look great:



For that matter, the Bioware werewolf looks better than the default gnoll.

As I understand it, bringing the gnoll model's textures closer to current standards wouldn't be a huge task. Or to put it another way, if we're only talking about improving the textures, a little bit of TLC would make a huge difference. The biggest bang for the buck would probably include a slight texture improvment for both the Bioware male gnoll model and NorvakDragon's female version. That would probably suffice for most people based on what I'm hearing here.

 
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Invisig0th, 08 mai 2013 - 04:12 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Invisig0th]

               The textures in question, just for reference:

Gnoll


Gnoll Wizard (forgot about him until I started digging in the resource files)

               
               

               

                     Modifié par Invisig0th, 08 mai 2013 - 04:42 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               the only good thing about the bio gnolls is the head. The rest is textured like a mess, totally unusable to retexture. I gave up on them as I tried reworking them. But whenever I find the mood to do some work again i unwrap the complete mesh and maybe use bits from low´s cool werewolfes.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par NWN_baba yaga, 08 mai 2013 - 07:07 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Killmonger]

               I've never really used Gnolls to any extent, tho they have caught my eye of late

After a quick image search, my two cents are:

1) Their bioware armour is too tight, not fluidly useful like a proud Gnol would prefer (?)

2) The eyes are not very animalistic, and perhaps a few alternate "demeanors" could be stylized.
Hyena ears are great, teeth of course, but perhaps more sly and weasel-like. Think LionKing or Madagascar

3) I agree with Babayaga. But the Gnol character needs to be not so "wolfy"

jmo
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Master Jax]

               I agree with you, Invisig0th. I think the way to go, not only with Gnolls, but everything else NWN is "less blurry, want sharper, higher resolution." However, what has been said is true. Perhaps for Gnolls to be updated, a whole reworking of the mapping would be needed, and not just simple image-editing.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_PLUSH HYENA of DOOM]

               I've a whole (small) series of Gnoll Adventures Modules that I did some years ago. I loved the Gnoll model but wasn't hugely in love with the textures. I think I created about five completely new ones for the main Gnoll characters and did what I could with the textures for the standard BioWare/CEP ones. But I haven't done much with those Modules of late and I'd probably look at the improvements I made and wish to improve them further now.
Hellishly busy with other things at the moment, but I'll go and dig my Gnoll out and have a look at them when I get the chance. Some may be of use.
(I replaced the BioWare "fur" with photographs taken from a life-size museum replica Hyena in my collection which I then cut about and rotated as required to fit the map, so they definitely look more authentically furry than before).
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               Imo the texture resolution of 512*512 is pretty good as long as the texture/ skin itself is good. The dragons for example would look much better with a skinmesh and no gaps between all their little body parts. In a dark area only lit by torches they look absolutely crap to me with all these visible bodyparts. Also many original textures have a strange color palette. Just one color with highligths and shadows and thats it. CODI were really good in creating a wonderfull collection of versatile creatures.... problem...original bio content is so limited in colors and textures. This awfull bright wood texture that you saw everywhere but replaced by PQs much darker wood texture.

Well that was OT a bit '>

But i say go for the gnolls '> I really like gnolls!
               
               

               

                     Modifié par NWN_baba yaga, 09 mai 2013 - 07:20 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Invisig0th]

               Is it possible that the problem with the gnolls is not so much the texture itself, but that the texture is stretched/skewed/etc. where it is applied to the model? I have encountered something similar with other Bioware models (one of the mummies, I think). Anyway, if that is the case with the gnolls, would it be possible to get substantial improvements by fixing the way the textures are applied so that no stretching occurs? I wonder if that would un-blur the fur that can be clearly seen in the textures, but not on the creature model in game.

PHoD -- I would love to see whatever you have. PM me if you like. Thanks!
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Invisig0th, 09 mai 2013 - 07:57 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               I recall that the bodyparts have no order in the texture. So legs are not above the shins and feet and the forearm is not below the bicep and so on. Without a proper order of the parts makes it nearly unpossible to create a seamless skin. The head and torso i think is safe.

so the idea using low´s werewolfes in a grey and brown spotted color is a the way to go. The model is awesome, the proportions are right + animations and the skin is perfect for a retexturizer '>
               
               

               

                     Modifié par NWN_baba yaga, 09 mai 2013 - 08:31 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Zwerkules]

               

Invisig0th wrote...

Is it possible that the problem with the gnolls is not so much the texture itself, but that the texture is stretched/skewed/etc. where it is applied to the model? I have encountered something similar with other Bioware models (one of the mummies, I think). Anyway, if that is the case with the gnolls, would it be possible to get substantial improvements by fixing the way the textures are applied so that no stretching occurs? I wonder if that would un-blur the fur that can be clearly seen in the textures, but not on the creature model in game.

PHoD -- I would love to see whatever you have. PM me if you like. Thanks!

I haven't looked at the models yet, but the textures don't seem to be badly blurred. The problem probably really lies with how the textures are applied to the models.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Invisig0th]

               Yes, that's what I was thinking, too. There is passable quality "fur" in that texture already, but I certainly don't see it on the model.

That being the case, if someone were to remove the skewing and stretching on the existing model, wouldn't we get substantial improvements from that alone? By that I mean edit the model and leave the texure alone. Perhaps that would yeild good results without too much effort.

I realize that this would probably require re-using areas of the texture that were not intended for that particular body part, but as far as I can see there is not much part-specific content anyway besides the the head and armor. Applying some of the "generic" fur areas to the legs and arms would (should) instantly look much better than the defult version, I suspect
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Invisig0th, 09 mai 2013 - 09:30 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_3RavensMore]

               Gnolls feature significantly in my world; I never thought they looked bad, but improvements are always welcome.  I'd love to see a good dynamic one.  '>

And off topic but, Invisig0th your 1.69 Spell Spreadsheet is great.  I use it quite often.