A coupel of question in the matter of doors

[Legacy_s e n]

               I am cooking new doors for the Terria tileset, and after a bit of thinking I decided do make them as generic ones, despite the fact they dont are standard nwn 3x2 dimensions, but scaled to the models, something like 1x2.25, slightly larger and higher than the halforc male model (probably the phat pheno of the halforc will have some probs in stepping past the door '>, but thats it!). Also, I made the animation so open close 1 and 2 are the same. they open always towards the exterior. Now, my questions:
1. in genericdoors.2da there is a VisibleModel column. what is that about?
2. I managed to remove the blue lighting of the transition that comes once the door is open (its controlled by the sam mesh of the door model) but I dunno how to cut the blue highlight of the door it self, that comes when you hover on it be it opened or closed... is it possible to remove it?
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Master Jax]

               I would actually like to see a re-done model for the original doors. They are just not proportionate. Lower, smaller, locks and handles would do a lot for realism.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Bannor Bloodfist]

               You really can't go much smaller than the original Bioware 3x2 size.  Character size alone is not all that has to be considered.  The perspace for any creature is typically quite a bit larger than the actual creature itself.  

As to resizing generic doors, that won't work unless you actually feel like editing nearly every tileset out there.  Each doorway would have to be adjusted as well.  HUGE amount of work involved with that.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_s e n]

               Perspace is a **** hehe. not an issue here since those are all transitioning doors but for passage doors like the most part of interior tilesets thats real thing to be considered (made a test with half orc, it doesnt walk past 1 meter large doors. the human model does. but, solution should be slightly adjust the settings of the perspace in the appearances 2da. there may come some mesh collision, but its all designer choice.

fact is, for interiors like dungeons, caves and other tilesets planned to be the theater of battles with monsters, 2 meters wide doors is a necessity. i think the 3x2 doors are very (VERY) ugly but thats it, it is not possible to edit each single tile made since now to fit new scaled dimensions, like Bannor said it is a work of gargantuan size, and really not worth. what is possible, I think, is to study the problem and project new generic doors for new interior tilesets to match world scale.

from my perspective this means deciding a generic dimension for single generic doors (basically, the width, I made 1 meter, it may come that making 1.1 or even 1.2 may be wiser to allow a few more critters to be able to step in) and, realise that natural environment need wider generic doors (1.5 maybe), and making multiple sizes of generic doors brings the need to categorize them, i think a tlk edit for names showing in the toolset would be needed, etc etc. so its still a lot of work, but doable if someone plans to make new interiors.

no blue hints?
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_s e n]

               a small update after little test: perspace of the half orc is 0.3, as is the one of all standard races but hin (0.25). what blocks movement of the halforc is the height value (appearance.2da column). with my doors of 2.25, the 2da height valueof the halforc (2.25) causes block of movement. changing it to 2.10 allows the halforc to step on the passage.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_henesua]

               why not adjust your door to slightly larger than the halforc? That way your content will work with standard perspace values.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_s e n]

               uhm, there is no problem with perspace of the halforc. the height problem comes from obscuring face of the walkmesh set at 2.25 (you know the fading cube of the buildings behind the doors), something done with transitioning doors and not passage ones, which usually have their walkmesh obscured just in vertical. of course there is not much room, but thats the compromise, and if I ever do a new interior, I will use those door dimensions for generic doors.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               My castle stone interior and my latest city tileset both have realistic sizes for doors... around 1*2,3m and I havent had any issues with them so far. With realistic i mean when you take the boundaries of a human as the base...
               
               

               

                     Modifié par NWN_baba yaga, 16 octobre 2012 - 02:00 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_henesua]

               Sen, sorry that I mispoke, but the point is that if you make the doors just a little bit larger, no one else has to adjust their appearance.2da just to use your doors/tileset.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_s e n]

               Ehehehe Henesua what I mean is that for standard races 1 meter wide doors do not cause issues, unless you put horizontal obscuring meshes under the height of let's say 225+15 centimeters. if you dont use horizontal obscuring faces in the wok, and no one really does unless you want camera blocking controlled by woks, there shouldnt be any sort of issue for standard races.

Baba: its good if we standardize the doors, mines are 1x2.25 if yours are 1x2,3 there is little to do for me to match them, just tell meh!
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_henesua]

               Sorry, Sen. I guess I'm not following you well. Anyway, carry on.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Bannor Bloodfist]

               

s e n wrote...
<snipped>

no blue hints?

Oooppsss.... sorry, forgot to say that;

I have no real idea, other than to say that some of the door activation bit is hard coded into the game.  I vaguely remember requesting a change on that from BIoware, back during WCoC dev days when we still had Bioware's ear.  There was a HUGE list of requested changes that folks wanted though, and as well all know, only so many were addressed.

Been a while, but I think even a hidden door will still give a blue rectangle when you pass your mouse over it?  Will show up when you hit tab in game etc?  As I said, it has been a LONG time since I even considered making door changes other than tileset specific ones, and even then there is a limit to how many you can assign per tileset I believe, but I am likely wrong on that, someone else would have to clarify it for us.

If anyone still has any contact information for OldMansBeard, he would be the wizard with the answers.  Although, I do believe that he has put NWN on far back burner, likely turned off completely, since he is working with Skyrim development now, doing scripting again, which is his strong suit and most enjoyable for him I believe.

You might possibly be able to get the NWNX folks to take a look at possible solutions for the blue highlighting though.  Bioware just didn't have the resources assigned to NWN long before 1.69, we had to beg, borrow and steal folks to get 1.69 out the door as it was.  Of course, BIoware DID come through for us with 1.69, and we all should honestly thank them for their very major efforts for a game that they no longer recieved any compensation for, regardless of sales.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_s e n]

               Well yes, I hope there is some 2da setting to disable the blue hover/tab just like there is for creatures in appearance.2da, been trying to add targetable column to doortypes and genericdoors 2das without success
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               @sen
i´m checking my door sizes again just to be sure. ok, the arched default door!

wide:1
height:2,02 (to where the arch starts) + 0,69 (center of the top arch) damn did i f***** it up a bit. But i cant change that anymore... way to many doorframes i would have to redo. But i think we´re on the same goal:) Are your doors rectangle shaped? If yes i will go with your size then!

Well let me rethink: I´m sure i can get the generic archdoor to 1*2m in rectangle and add 0,7m for the arch. Sounds good?

So,
arched    door  = 1*2m/2,7m
genedric door = 1*2,25m
               
               

               

                     Modifié par NWN_baba yaga, 16 octobre 2012 - 06:51 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_s e n]

               sounds great, its the same size for the generic door, so can safely mix em! if you send me the geometry of a tile with the arched door I will use it for mines as well