Tile - walkmesh-issue: Partly only one-way-walk possible

[Legacy_Bannor Bloodfist]

               Oh, sorry for this really late reply to this but there are some things you need to watch and set correctly.

The PATHNODE as defined in the tile(s) .mdl file needs to also be correct.

There are several tutorials listed on the site in my signature that may help with that.  Some of the pathnodes look a bit confusing, they may work, but then again, they may appear to cause a toon to get stuck.

For a specific tile that has walkable sections on your upper and lower parts of a tile, but that are not truly connected, IE only the roof and street level are walkable, with a high wall/building face in between, you would need a pathnode that specifically handles that or your toons can get easily stuck.  

Sorry,.I am not at home on my normal computer so I don't have access to the many different screen shots I would use to explain the different pathnodes available.  Here is a link to the "Pathnodes" thread that is available in my tutorials section from the original CTP site now hosted on Harvest Moon.  There are many tuturials in that same forum and a few others located in various other forums there as well.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_TheOneBlackRider]

               Thanks for still checking on this, since this one is a bit older by now. '>
And meanwhile I managed all the tiles I wanted and have them integrated into the DLCR-project. All works fine.
And still: Those pathnodes were still a bit of a riddle to me (but since my stuff was behaving, I didn't dive any further into it). And the link to the "Pathnodes" thread clears quiet a bit.
So thanks for pointing me into that direction!
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Bannor Bloodfist]

               Believe me I know how you feel when you first start looking at the actual shots of what a pathnode is.

Black is walkable though, and intersections to the edges are where most toons will attempt to walk onto a given tile.  If there are not fairly direct connections to any other tile across an area, then the toon will get stuck and just stand around trying to figure out how to move around.

what is most confusing is looking at a given pathnode and seeing two separate bars that go from side to side, each with a single connection in the middle going to the outside edge.  The particular path node I am referring to is the "C" (capitol C) pathnode.  That is actually for a wall, OR for a raised tile.  Can be used for either one.  What it shows is that the toon can walk along the edge of the wall, on either side, but can NOT cross the blank white section in between.  This would be the same on a raised tile... you can walk right up to the edge on the TOP side, but not be able to get down, OR walk right up to the edge on the lower / Bottom side and not be able to get up to the top.

The most confusing are the double lower case letters, and to be honest, those are seldom used.  They were actually created by Bioware for Chandigar's original Aztec set.  They really only work well with that set, at least, I have not seen any other builder make use of them.

That was an attempt by Bioware to help the community because at the time of that particular aztec set release, toons were getting stuck all over the set due to how Chandigar had created some strange walkable sections.  That set was "patched" by Chandigar to use the new pathnodes with the help of the CTP... we told him which pathnodes to use for which complex tile etc...

Anyway, one way to learn the different pathnodes, is to do a search on "pathnode=?" and see what is applied to various tiles by the author of a given set.  The more correct tilesets will use many of the various pathnodes, while the most incorrect sets will primarily use "Pathnode A" which is supposed to be used for a completely flat tile with nothing blocking any movement from any side... think a flat grass plane.  However, tileset authors that have not learned how to apply the correct one, will use A as the default as it appears to work for many situations.

When you have a toon getting stuck, most especially followers of some sort, it is usually a bad series of pathnode assignments in the .set file.  Doesn't take a heck of a lot of effort to correct, but you have to manually edit the .set file and assign the correct pathnode to each tile.  Typically I do this by loading the tileset in the toolset and doing some painting of the various tiles to see if I can find the bad ones, OR finding an issue while playing and then investigating what tiles have the issue via the toolset again.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_TheOneBlackRider]

               Thanks for further explanations.
But now, I a question comes up to my old brain... Maybe I missed the point or I'm a bit stupid...
Why those pathnodes, when possible movement is (also) managed via the walkmesh? I mean, I could create a walkmesh like in those screenshots above and use pathnode A and all works well. So why still fiddle with pathnodes, if the walkmesh does the right restrictions.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Zwerkules]

               

TheOneBlackRider wrote...
Why those pathnodes, when possible movement is (also) managed via the walkmesh? I mean, I could create a walkmesh like in those screenshots above and use pathnode A and all works well. So why still fiddle with pathnodes, if the walkmesh does the right restrictions.

Because if you just use the pathnode A the npcs will get stuck. Let's say you have a wall that goes from the left side of the tile to the right side and used the pathnode A instead of C. When you control the toon and see the wall you know you can't just walk through it, but an npc is told by the pathnode that walking from the bottom of the tile to the top is possible and will try to do so. The walkmesh will block the movement when the npc reaches the wall, but the npc won't look for a way around the wall, because it 'thinks' there's a way through it. That way it will get stuck next to the wall.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_OldTimeRadio]

               

TheOneBlackRider wrote...
Why those pathnodes, when possible movement is (also) managed via the walkmesh? I mean, I could create a walkmesh like in those screenshots above and use pathnode A and all works well. So why still fiddle with pathnodes, if the walkmesh does the right restrictions.

Walkmesh decides where you can walk inside a tile.  If you click on a destination 4 tiles away, though, pathnodes give the game a good idea of how you're going to get from your origin to your destination without having to calculate the entire actual path- until you arrive at each of the tiles, which is where walkmesh takes over until you leave the tile again..

Walkmesh = Walking inside a tile
Pathnodes = Walking between tiles or going through multiple tiles.  Mostly concerned with where you're able to leave a tile and come into the next.

So you'll never really see the how pathnodes affect a tile just clicking inside a tile.  You'll see their effect clicking on other tiles, like a tile 3-4 tiles away.  Console renderaabb 1 and rendertilepathnodes 1 help view the pathing information when you're playing and can also be used to help place placeables in areas where they won't likely interfere with distance pathing.  It affects a lot more than players, too: NPCs who walk waypoints rely on having good pathing in and between tiles.  If they don't get it, things can become a CPU-hogging mess.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_TheOneBlackRider]

               Again: Learned something!
(Sometimes I wonder, how all this special knowledge made it all the way from the Bioware-creators to you custom genius-people! Thank god, that the knowledge has been shared!)
I guess, I have to look into my creations again... '> (Seems to be a never ending stroy '>
Thanks to you all for the enlightments.