Author Topic: Over Haul  (Read 2712 times)

Legacy_Draygoth28

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« Reply #150 on: March 19, 2013, 10:12:47 pm »


               Having trouble finding all the h_ba. Any suggestions on were to locate them all.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_OldTimeRadio

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« Reply #151 on: March 19, 2013, 10:29:47 pm »


               

Draygoth28 wrote...
Having trouble finding all the h_ba. Any suggestions on were to locate them all.

Yep, you can find them in HOTU Patch Data, in Models.  If you ever need to search, you can select any of the tree list items on the left (in the screenshot below), hit CTRL-S and then type in what you want to search for and hit enter.  It'll search from that point on down and it won't loop back up to the top again so if I'm looking for something and I have no idea where it's going to be, I just search from "NWN Main Data" right at the top.

'Posted
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Nissa_Red

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« Reply #152 on: March 19, 2013, 10:34:16 pm »


               Please open your NWNexplorer.

Click on "NWN:HoTU Patch Data" :

'Posted
(click to enlarge)

and browse down to find them :

'Posted

Then you can right-click on each of them to export them (directly as binary models).

If you need them uncompiled, click on the "Ascii Model" tab first to the right side, then right-click somewhere in the window to export.

EDIT : Woops, OTR beat me to it, just shows how slow I am at typing >.<
               
               

               


                     Modifié par Nissa_Red, 19 mars 2013 - 10:35 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_Draygoth28

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« Reply #153 on: March 19, 2013, 11:15:34 pm »


               Well I got it to work once, but got an error message about bones. Now it is says unable to locate super model "h_ba" again. Not sure what I am doing wrong.
I found them all and loaded into G-Max one at a time. Then compiled to desktop to get the ascii file for each one. I placed them into the compiled folder, (didn't work) then into the decompiled folder (didn't work). if I let the compiler run it just goes down the list of each one and says can't find.
               
               

               


                     Modifié par Draygoth28, 19 mars 2013 - 11:33 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_OldTimeRadio

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« Reply #154 on: March 20, 2013, 12:12:37 am »


               @Draygoth28 - Here's how you want to get the ASCII version of any model:
1. Load NWN Explorer Reborn
2. Find the model and double-click on it (doesn't matter if you see anything or not when it loads)
3. At the bottom of the preview window, you're going to see some tab-like headings, like "Model", "ASCII Model", "ASCII Model Hierarchy" and so on.  Click on the ASCII Model tab.
4. On the resulting preview window, at the top, will be a tab with the name of the model.  Right click on that and select "Export Text" to export the text you see to a file.

'Posted

That's quite a bit quicker way of going about it.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_OldTimeRadio

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« Reply #155 on: March 20, 2013, 12:15:54 am »


               The way I just showed (above) will get you those files, individually.  You'll probably need to chop off the ".txt" extension it adds to the end.  Keep a copy someplace handy.  Copy the ASCII .mdl files either into the "in" folder or maybe where you have the model compiler executable.  For the DLA compiler, I don't do it with folders (I do everything in the same folder) so I'm not sure.  Once you've run it once, ther'es a good chance it may have compiled the (h_ba_*.mdl) models you put in the directory to facilitate compilation, so you may have to recopy them into your folder again.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Draygoth28

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« Reply #156 on: March 20, 2013, 03:12:21 am »


               no matter what I try, it says unable to locate super model "h_ba". Not sure if I'm not setting it up right, or if there is something more needed.
*Anybody want to take a crack at it. I can upload one of the models in asc format. I really want to figure this out.
               
               

               


                     Modifié par Draygoth28, 20 mars 2013 - 10:28 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_OldTimeRadio

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« Reply #157 on: March 20, 2013, 01:38:15 pm »


               You can either PM or email me the model and I'll see what I can do.

It may be that you're doing everything correctly and the issue is related to how the compilation process works with these models in the supermodel chain.  As much as we might consider ourselves lucky to have all these wonderful tools (either Bioware or community made) at our disposal, outside of a certain range of operations things can become very difficult. 

It's my belief that some of the tools Bioware and Floodgate Entertainment used to produce NWN and its expansions (especially the expansions) may have differed considerably from what the community has access to, even today.
               
               

               


                     Modifié par OldTimeRadio, 20 mars 2013 - 01:47 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_NWN_baba yaga

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« Reply #158 on: March 20, 2013, 10:27:24 pm »


               man that elephant rocks!
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Bluebomber4evr

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« Reply #159 on: March 21, 2013, 04:41:30 am »


                Draygoth, that camel and elephant are amazing!
If you make a hippopotamus and a giraffe you will be my hero ':lol:'
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Draygoth28

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« Reply #160 on: March 21, 2013, 11:19:01 am »


               I have several more models that I may be able to use. It all hangs on whether they can be compiled as mounts. If not they cause lag / hitching.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_OldTimeRadio

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« Reply #161 on: March 21, 2013, 03:09:32 pm »


               Okay, got this working.  Couple of points about this particular model and the model you're using as a skeleton for it:

1. This model's skin mesh is 13k triangles and almost 7k verts.  In comparison, the base DLA horse has two skin mesh sections which combine for 532 triangles and 271 verts.  So that's 25-26x times as many verts the engine is being asked to manipulate.  IMO, this elephant is more art than game model.  For a tile or a static placeable (with shadows turned off), these aren't scary numbers.  Those numbers for a dynamic model, though?  I'd go looking for more game-ready art.

2.Texture needs to be power of 2.  As it was, the texture was 800 x 540.  This may work on your video card but for older cards (NVidia pre 7000 series or thereabouts) this is either going to bring the whole game to a crawl the moment it's loaded or the card won't load the texture at all.  All you have to do to fix this is to resize the texture to 512x512.  It'll look distorted to you, but the way the engine uses the texture, it'll look fine in-game and it won't cause any problems for people with older cards.

'Posted 'Posted

Besides, the DDS conversion tool will throw an error if you try to compile TGA->DDS without using power of 2 textures.  (i.e. height and width need to be 32, 64, 128, 256, 512, 1024, etc.though they probably don't have to be square)

3. Shadows and textures should be removed from all the skeleton bones.  Only a few of your bones have shadows and I don't think many of them have textures, so it shouldn't take too long to fix.  For bones, I believe this is as easy as editing the text file for the skeleton you're using (I presume you have a default skeleton) and do a text replace so all "bitmap" lines read "bitmap NULL"- except those for "node skin", which are your skin nodes.  To fix the shadows, similarly make sure all the shadow lines read "Shadow 0" instead of "Shadow 1".  If you're re-using the skeleton, you only have to fix these issues once.

4. Add an Auroa TriMesh Modifier to your Skin(s), drag them under the skin modifier (A) and turn on Override Material Values(B).  If you don't do this, your skins will look unnecessarily dark in-game.  Click below for larger:

'Posted

None of these things above are nitpicky: They have a real impact on your model's performance and display in-game, though it's often difficult to tell it because when testing models we typically are looking at them in a blank area and not in an otherwise complicated scene (i.e. placeables, other creatures moving around, etc.).

Here's a very simple kit with all the models you're going to need to compile mounts, including the compiler and instructions.  Works just like I indicated before, from the command line:

'Posted

'<img'>
               
               

               


                     Modifié par OldTimeRadio, 21 mars 2013 - 03:15 .
                     
                  


            

Legacy_Draygoth28

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« Reply #162 on: March 21, 2013, 09:33:21 pm »


               I will make all the changes you mentioned. Was there much lag after you got the model compiled?
               
               

               
            

Legacy_Nissa_Red

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« Reply #163 on: March 21, 2013, 09:46:42 pm »


               Thank you, OTR, for looking into this for Draygoth, and the community as a whole, since if Draygoth releases it at a later time, we'll all be benefitting from it.

I also keep learning from your very informative posts all the time.
               
               

               
            

Legacy_OldTimeRadio

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« Reply #164 on: March 21, 2013, 09:55:34 pm »


               Lag loading-wise:
When I informally tested it with the uncompiled model, loading in the toolset the compile time was something pretty bad, seemed at least 30+ seconds, possibly much more.  In situations where the model hasn't compiled in about 5 seconds, I just go to the task manger, drop the process priority level on nwtoolset.exe and go do something else, checking back occasionally.

After being compiled, the load time in the toolset was about two seconds.  I normally don't even attempt dynamic models with this level of complexity but I will say that my experience loading static objects that even around 150k+ triangle models, when precompiled, usually load in something around two seconds.  I think it's disk access speed mostly. 

Lag gameplay-wise:
When you've compiled a model, you've done half the hard work up front for NWN.  In a case of all the vert deformations from bone movement, the elephant seemed to walk smoothly, even when tested on a GeForce 3 Ti 200.  However, this can be misleading because NWN throws everything it has at a scene and when the scene is just rural grass and the elephant, it can deal with it.  I have no idea how well that would work a a normal scene with placeables, other creatures moving around, etc. 
               
               

               


                     Modifié par OldTimeRadio, 21 mars 2013 - 09:56 .