Why haven't anyone done a game like NWN since?

[Legacy_GhostOfGod]

               This is something me and my buddy have been talking about for years. If a game company wants to make money on a game like NWN they could do it like the Sims. They could release content packs and it would work great for D&D. Buy the main game and then buy the Ravenloft, Blackmoor, Greyhawk, etc expansions/content just like how the Sims has Pets, vacation, seasons, etc. And the game could still implement free player made custom content like the Sims did. It would be perfect!
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WebShaman]

               

GhostOfGod wrote...

This is something me and my buddy have been talking about for years. If a game company wants to make money on a game like NWN they could do it like the Sims. They could release content packs and it would work great for D&D. Buy the main game and then buy the Ravenloft, Blackmoor, Greyhawk, etc expansions/content just like how the Sims has Pets, vacation, seasons, etc. And the game could still implement free player made custom content like the Sims did. It would be perfect!

It is a nice notion, surely.  But it is fraught with licence issues, that currently are just not stable enough to warrent gambling on.

I personally think the idea has merit.  But getting the licences...hooboy.  Just imagining how difficult trying to patch the game would be boggles the mind...

I think this is why Bioware went with it's own ID for both Dragonage and ME, instead of continuing with D&D and Star Wars, etc...although there was that KotOR thing, right?

I sooooo wanted Gamma World *sigh*
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WebShaman]

               

Tarot Redhand wrote...

Have you considered Talislanta (still no elves) as the setting? All versions are now free to download including the d20 version.

TR

It has merit, no doubt, but it is just not complete IMHO without certain elements.  I can't have my Fantasy World without Dark Elves (Drow). 

Perhaps The_World_of_Synnibarr would work...
               
               

               

                     Modifié par WebShaman, 14 novembre 2013 - 01:22 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_ShadowM]

               www.axisgamefactory.com/
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_YeoldeFog]

               

ShadowM wrote...

www.axisgamefactory.com/

When do we start? '>
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Aelis Eine]

               

*casts Animate Dead on thread*

 

Shards Online, a Kickstarter project claiming to "let the players run their own servers" and feature "unlimited custom rulesets" is holding an open preview weekend to showcase their alpha version. Check their blog for more info: http://citadelstudios.net/?p=2458

 

It looks a little unpolished and very indie right now but if they can deliver player-hosted, moddable servers it'll be the first Fantasy game to do that in over 10 years.

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Urk]

               

*casts Animate Dead on thread*

 

Shards Online, a Kickstarter project claiming to "let the players run their own servers" and feature "unlimited custom rulesets" is holding an open preview weekend to showcase their alpha version. Check their blog for more info: http://citadelstudios.net/?p=2458

 

It looks a little unpolished and very indie right now but if they can deliver player-hosted, moddable servers it'll be the first Fantasy game to do that in over 10 years.

 

Someone posted this link on the Facebook builders page. I checked it out, though, and it's really not what we're looking for. It's moddable in code, but it doesn't include any kind of editor. It also doesn't look like it has any kind of server client. All games need to be hosted on the citadel server. There were a number of other issues too. If anyone cares they can check out the Facebook comment I left, but in short...

 

I wish them luck, but I have no personal interest in this project. 

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Waschlaff Duschmann]

               

They are all on the mmorpg ride. Pathfinder mmorpg, D&D mmorpg and now elder scrolls mmorpg.

 

mmorpgs evolved from muds and its certainly an interesting concept, what sold NWN is however another concept, its the original concept of RPGs and i mean pen and paper rpgs. Its actuall not so much a rpg as it is a rpg SYSTEM. Like a pen and paper edition of D&D where players can and do create their own contend. And naturally this bodes for crpgs actually better than mmorpgs because... thats where the game systems originated from. But today where the game industry is big money nobody wants to do experimental investments.

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_zunath]

               

I've been working on a project similar to NWN for the past few months. It's still early, and there's only one person developing it (me) but my goal is to offer three tools: a toolset, a server application, and the game client.

 

My biggest hurdles right now are finding developers to assist with writing the code and obtaining art assets.

 

Here's a few screenshots of the work-in-progress:

 

http://i9.photobucke...zpsae3026e8.png

http://i9.photobucke...zps35f07773.png

http://i9.photobucke...zpsf3a18476.png

 

 

Is there any interest in a project like this? Would anyone want to help with its development?

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               

hey zunath,

 

is your engine using 2d sprites for characters and monsters? I noticed the animated sprites. I like more and more a mix between modern and old school games so i´m not turned off by that stuff. I have a lot of experience in everything design related just not "hand painting" things. But textures, models and anything else shouldnt be a problem. I would like to know more about the 2d or 3d capabilities, a simple skill and quest system and how combat you think you want to implement. Like is it will be done like old dungeon crawler games (Easy but works anyway) or more AC/ THaco based like D&D etc.

 

And 3 base classes are enough for me too. If the toolset is good enough to create great adventures you dont normaly need more then these 3 types... like quest for glory.

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_zunath]

               

Hey thanks for the reply. It's designed for 2D because those assets are easier to program for and create. I considered going with 3D early on, but it's already a huge project as-is so to eliminate some of the work I decided to roll with 2D.

 

I'm actually designing it in a way that classes can be created through the toolset. The three listed are just pieces of dummy data I'm using for the time being. The idea is that each server will have its own specific rules which can be customized via scripts (like NWN, but with some more control).

 

 

I'm also still a little torn on the direction I want to take with combat. I like the NWN style, but I know a lot of gamers today prefer quicker combat systems. I looked at using the D&D ruleset (there's an open source ruleset WOTC offers) but it comes with some stipulations. Whatever route I go with, the combat can be customized up to a point using scripts.

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               

sounds good so far. Combat is a realy huge thing one has to exactly know how it should be. You know i think many different types of combat simulations i like. There is this click and click combat from quest for glory (which is hardcore and funny at the same time) then complex rules like nwn and fps combat where you just use the mouse (similar to old shot em ups) and thats it. A great thing would be an adventure editor where you can use these 2d tilesets like old zelda stuff, Baldurs gate or something like old cannon fodder and a simple 3d/2d (tunnel) system like old eye of beholder. It´s not realy 3d anyway and it could be very cool to switch to this system when you lets say move trough mines or caves, thick forest or jungle etc.

 

But combat is realy important for me to know what the possibilities are and how customizable enemys can be like increasing their armor and hitpoints and give them some special attacks that just make nice effects but deal only regular damage...

 

When you think about how the old guys did games like platoon for c64 (especialy 3 different types of levels) i´m impressed today way more then i was back then. Sure the gfx looks ehm... well c64 like but it such a cool kind of game design. Just an example on how one can do great things with not todays FPS superhardcore Crytek engine stuff. Now i think anyway that our todays FPS is nothing more then old shoot em ups with a cursor and oversimulated realitys. But the concept is always the same.

 

So it would be cool if someone can just create modern sprites too, use only ranged weapon with custom sounds and these 2s/3d stuff and voila you have a little cool action shooter game too.

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Grani]

               Interesting.

I might be an exception, but I personally believe that it is a good thing that no game like NWN has been made.

Why? Well, first of all, as long as NWN has a kin of monopoly on the combination of its three attributes mentioned in the first post, it can still hope to attract new players, which means that new modules and content will still be released. The uniqueness of this game is what keeps it alive and if there were any ciable alternatives, many people would choose them ocer NWN.


It wouldn't mecessarily be bad, but make way for my second concern, as it's related.

Call me a pessimist, but I highly doubt that if a new game like NWN was created, it would have nearly as much content and complexity as NWN and everything that the community made for it in these 12 years.


Worse yet, with DRM craze that we experience today, it's very likely that this new game would be its next victim. Imagine NWN with online authentication, and all other miseries of DRM.


All in all:

1. New NWN would likely divide the community, which is already spread thin

2. It's improbable for this new game to have as much content as NWN

3. DRM


I think that, instead of wanting another game like NWN, we should just play this one.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_NWN_baba yaga]

               

@Grani

 

Good points you made and i dont disagree with them. The only thing i know for myself where i wish we could use a different engine is the "renderer". I want shadow maps so badly and some other nice effects which they didnt even bothered to think about back then but where already in use by other games. So for me it´s only some Render specific stuff including fixing the damn alpha bugs.

 

And to bad that the nwshader person just did stuff that didnt fix anything or realy enhanced the renderer. Everything in it was very broken for me and shadows are the most important part for every 3d environment. There are even open source codes available with engine stuff written in C and C+ for halfllife, quake etc. that one could use just to throw in some cool new things but i guess most people want to ONLY use their stuff and invent the wheel again... which is nonsense imo.

               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Sumthing]

               

 

Part of the problem is companies worrying about return on investment - they want to be able to either keep selling new games or at least new expansions. Making a game like NWN at this point would still be doable but it would require a very different system of payment to work - a much higher up-front cost, some sort of subscription model, or something else entirely. It's simply not worth making a user friendly toolset for most games.

 

Or you could release it on steam (as an option, rather than forcing people to use steam DRM), opening it up for hundreds of people, who might buy it when it comes on sale, or just if they see it in general. They will recommend it to their friends if it is good, who might buy it, and recommend it to their friends, so on and so forth. I think it is worth it. You could have a Steam Workshop, which would keep the game alive, and even might persuade people to buy the game if it has enough good content and modability, because that is a definite selling point I have heard people mention.

 

Also, if people wanted to make money off their modules, they could send it to the team in charge of the game for sale if it is considered to be of a high enough standard. Now, you might not want this sort of idea taking hold, that people would be able to make money off modules, but, they could sell them for really cheap, or bundle them together in module packs, giving both the developers a small amount of money, and the module maker, encouraging them to make more content, and giving the developers money to make expansions or sequels to the game. Then, hopefully, you will still have people who make modules and content for free, despite the fact that they could monetize it if it is good enough. (You could always just remove this feature and have the team develop modules for sale like the premium modules, while all community modules are free, but if cash is really short, then it could be done I suppose)