Sorry, been busy. Back into the fray!
Kail Pendragon wrote...
I use the game mechanics to build a character build which represents that character concept within the specific game mechanics as faithfully as possible (100% being ideal, but that has to clash with the game mechanic limits generally speaking). It has nothing to do with power, it has to do with faithfulness to the concept.
I don't understand how you determine faithfulness. For example, since we're using the Fighter 39/Wizard 2 example, what makes that more or less faithful than a Fighter 38/Wizard 2 or Fighter 37/Wizard 3? Or referencing the Cleric 38/Monk 2, how is that more faithful than Cleric 39/Monk 1 or Cleric 35/Monk 5?
To repeat myself from earlier,
"Actually, I wasn't referring to "level 1" being particularly significant, just that a character with 4 mage levels has spent more time training as a mage than a character with 2 mage levels. Or would you disagree with that?"
Lowlander wrote...
It makes more sense than arguing that a particular build is superior because you load him up with custom items not typically found.
I don't see why you thinking having +5 Intelligence rings is normal, but having +5 Wisdom or +5 Charisma rings is not. I'm thinking over the SP mods I've played and I don't recall a single one that didn't have lots of custom items. The same is true (even more so) for PWs.
Lowlander wrote...
Besides A level 39 something/rogue 1 is silly build almost anywhere but a server that does instant or near instant 40th level. Play anywhere reasonable paced level progression and you will never see such a build
You'll see those builds wherever the hardest content is at level 40 and people are expected to play level 40 characters for a long time. Doesn't matter if it takes an hour or three months to hit 40.
MrZork wrote...
It still seems like there is an assumption that a pure build in a class that is supposed to be good at something must therefore be better at that thing than a multiclassed build.
You mean like assuming a pure Wizard will be better at arcane spellcasting than a multi-classed Wizard?
MrZork wrote...
But what there is is the opportunity to use something that rogues are particularly good at, which is using their tumble ability to avoid attacks in combat.
....
Maybe because, in this fairly narrow example, the level split sweet spot for the trade-off in fighter training and rogue training occurs at one late level of rogue.
I think Tumble is broken in concept, mechanical implementation, and balance. AFAIK, in DnD you can't even use Tumble in medium or heavy armor. I don't see how a person in full plate and tower shield is going to be able to emply tumbling skill to move away from an attack. The idea of tumbling is different than the idea of dodging aside (and Dodge is a Fighter bonus feat).
And actually, as long as you took the rogue level at level 7 or later, the Fighter 39/Rogue 1 will win.
Weiser_Cain wrote...
I love multiclassing and a dip in a class, say monk is fine in my book, it even works in character, say you spent a summer learning to focus and throw a punch without leaving yourself open to getting stabbed in the guts. People that don't like it should just not do it and TRY NOT TO RUIN THE FUN OF OTHERS.
...really? You think people who limit multiclassing or adjust class abilities/benefits are out to ruin the fun of others, instead of trying to *improve* the fun of others?
Webshaman wrote...
So the Fighter 39/Wiz 1 can't cast Epic Spells, obviously. I am sure MM was just using that as an example to compare it with the SD level 1 getting HiPS.
Correct. My point was that a Wizard 1 being able to cast Epic Spells doesn't make sense conceptually, since we associate more levels in a class with more training in a class, and 1 level of Wizard isn't sufficient training for Epic Spells. Maybe the Epic Spell isn't a very good Epic Spell and for whatever reason the character winds up actually being worse off by learning to cast it, aka it's not unbalancing. But it still doesn't make sense conceptually.
Lowlander wrote...
I have no problem with the mechanics, because when you encourage cheese you get cheese. It is that simple, most people drawn to the cheese servers expect this, so there are likely few complaints.
This is pretty much what I said when I entered the thread where I was talking about concept and result. It's when you have people who don't want cheese and people who do want cheese on the same server that you get an issue. You can't balance for both, but you can balance for either.
zDark Shadowz wrote...
A football player may very well learn how to dance to help increase their co-ordination skills for football in real life.
Or...they could just do football drills that increase their coordination.
Modifié par Magical Master, 06 août 2011 - 10:23 .
