Cleave Attack Bonus

[Legacy_gwaedin]

               I just finished the prelude with my elven monk (now level 3).
While killing small gangs of goblins I appreciated the Cleave feat at work.
However I noticed that while my usual attack (single by now) came with a +2 bonus (probably now +3), the extra attack granted by Cleave was made with +0. I tried looking on NWN Wiki under Free attack to understand why but I'm not sure I got it right. It says: "When a free attack is inserted in the main-hand sequence, a main-hand attack gets "promoted" to either full base attack (if this is the first such promotion) or -5 off the previous promotion's base attack, and a "true" free attack is added to the free attack progression to make up for the lost regular attack".
From what I understand, since I have no additional attacks coming after the first one, there is no "promotion" and the cleave free attack comes as a second attack which following the Monk's -3 progression results in a +0 attack. Is it correct?
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_avado]

               Cleave is an attack to a new opponent when you kill the one you are facing dies.  What you say sounds correct after reading the complex answer at the wiki!  The one thing I wonder about now is, shouldnt you loose -5, not the 3 you suggest, which would put your ab LOWER still?  AB-5 after all is ab-5!  LOL
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_gwaedin]

               If the cleave attack goes as (in this particular case) the second attack for a Monk it should be -3.
However it's hard to tell since the system ignores negative ABs (that's why cleave is made with 0 AB).
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_avado]

               

gwaedin wrote...

If the cleave attack goes as (in this particular case) the second attack for a Monk it should be -3.
However it's hard to tell since the system ignores negative ABs (that's why cleave is made with 0 AB).

Im sorry, I dont understand.  Why do you think a monk gets a special ab advantage?   I have played this game since 2004.  I have discussed this game with the best of the best in terms of character building.  How is it, in 7 years, did we miss that a monk only looses 3 ab where everyone else looses 5? 

Besides, cleave is a FREE attack!  It is good to understand it if you must, but as far as I know, it works as it is supposed to.  Why do you worry about a lvl 3 character when you have 37 levels more to consider? 
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Guest_Lowlander_*]

               Monks do have a special attack progression AB advantage, when using unarmed/kama
Here is a normal character attack progression with 12 bab:

+12/+7/+2

Here is an unarmed/kama Monk with 12 bab:
+12/+9/+6/+3

So everyone else loses 5 AB between the attacks, monks lose 3 in this case.

It looks like the OP wants to figure out for a cleave attack from an unarmed/kama monk if it will be at -3AB, like an extra attack in Monk progression or -5 AB like regular attack progression.

I haven't tested but I suspect it is a hard coded -5 and not based on the attack progression table currently in use.

EDIT:  Tested in combat debug mode with Level 4 monk(1 attack): Cleaves with monk unarmed are indeed at -5 . Oddly it appears that once in a while a cleave attack happens with no penalty.  I can't tell what the difference is.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Lowlander, 21 mai 2011 - 06:41 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Elhanan]

               Techless One here, so the following may not apply. Some other players have reported that some figure displays are not always accurate; may need to be in Debug mode to check validity of results.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_WebShaman]

               ^ This is also true - the character sheet is inaccurate.  Debug mode will show what is really going on.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Elhanan]

               

WebShaman wrote...

^ This is also true - the character sheet is inaccurate. Debug mode will show what is really going on.

Oooh! Got one right; where's that cookie?!
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_avado]

                 WHat on earth could this mean?  Web and Elhan are agreeing on something?   For all those who thought the world was going to end, they were RIGHT!  Actually, this is more terrifying than the world ending! 
               
               

               

                     Modifié par avado, 21 mai 2011 - 10:02 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Elhanan]

               

avado wrote...

  WHat on earth could this mean?  Web and Elhan are agreeing on something?   For all those who thought the world was going to end, they were RIGHT!  Actually, this is more terrifying than the world ending! 

Well, the world was predicted to end tonight, so take that for what it's worth....

FWIW; we tend to agree on facts.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Elhanan, 22 mai 2011 - 02:20 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_gwaedin]

               Thanks to everybody... now, if I could only set Subscribe and Instant notifications to work so that I can actually know when people answers, that would be great...