RE: Item Properties Cost Revision - Need Some Input

[Legacy_Pstemarie]

               As I'm still in the early stages of designing item blueprints, I'm thinking of doing something very drastic with item property costs for my PW and want some input.

I'm trying to keep the item costs as close to the PHB and DMG as possible, but it seems nearly impossible to do so given the current formulas and cost Bioware uses. Therefore, I'm considering wiping them completely (i.e. setting all iprp 2da costs to 0) and using just the "Additional Cost" property to set the item cost.

I'm pretty certain though that there is something I'm overlooking and really need some input...
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_henesua]

               You don't want to do this for any item properties that you will apply by script.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Pstemarie]

               Yeah I'm trying to avoid applying them by script - I've got so much going on in my equip/unequip events that I'm afraid its going to become an issue at some point down the road.

Crafting is going to be a custom system anyway that uses bench placeables and "ingredients". When you craft something the ingredients are destroyed and, if the craft check is successful, the new item is created.

This does bring up a question though - I can't remember if items are calculated into a creature's challenge rating. I know I can adjust manually as well if needed, but I'm thinking more along the lines of creature skins and the like.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par Pstemarie, 11 février 2013 - 11:48 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_Rolo Kipp]

               <trying to count...>

Items *are* calculated into the CR, at least in the toolset.
Easy test: drop a cloak that grants HIPS on an otherwise low CR creature.

It took one CC Maker's Avatar from CR ~19 to ~42!

And it has pretty much *got* to be the cost that is factored in.

Also, I think "Additional Cost" is limited to 32K. Could be wrong, but I seem to remember hitting that limit when I was testing the Treasure Chest.

<...that high>
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_henesua]

               I've had the same goal as you but didn't solve it.

One of my approaches was to create some new item properties that had no cost. Essentially I was trying to both preserve the existing cost metric for base equipment while having full control over costs for my standard Arnheim equipment. So these new properties related to mundane equipment. For example I gave all standard armors so damage reduction against the physical damage types. Obviously these should not add to the cost.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par henesua, 12 février 2013 - 12:10 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_ShadowM]

               You could do what I did in my HR base and add a bunch of additional Quality properties that are just for adjusting price. I have ones from -0.01 to -50 and from +0.01 to +50 this will let you get closer to goals of PNP prices. Just a thought
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Pstemarie]

               

Rolo Kipp wrote...

...Also, I think "Additional Cost" is limited to 32K. 

Yup it caps at 32,767 - so this path is out.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Tyndrel]

               CR also changes dramatically depending on the item type, I have some CR 5 creatures that, given a ring of 100% cold immunity, jump to CR 460, but if I take away the ring and give them an adult white dragon skin they return to CR 5.  This had me scratching my head til I got splinters.


               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Shadooow]

               

Tyndrel wrote...

CR also changes dramatically depending on the item type, I have some CR 5 creatures that, given a ring of 100% cold immunity, jump to CR 460, but if I take away the ring and give them an adult white dragon skin they return to CR 5.  This had me scratching my head til I got splinters.

I suggest not to use items that are not visible on NPC creatures, if possible. Not only it raises CR while creature weapons/skin does not, each item also raises the potential CPU usage. Especially if its a monster which you spawn in dozens. If possible transfer the abilities from items to creature skin, or apply these properties as an effect via script.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Tyndrel]

               

ShaDoOoW wrote...

I suggest not to use items that are not visible on NPC creatures, if possible. Not only it raises CR while creature weapons/skin does not, each item also raises the potential CPU usage. Especially if its a monster which you spawn in dozens. If possible transfer the abilities from items to creature skin, or apply these properties as an effect via script.

Thanks ShaDoOoW, yes, they now have a custom skin, but by that point I'd already built an immunity and random ability system based on those invisible and undroppable items in an effort to reduce the eventual number of blueprints and prevent predictability.  At Shadow Mountain we reached the resouce limits, forcing me to start a new world just to get my building "fix", I was trying to prevent this happening again.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Highv Priest]

               

Pstemarie wrote...

As I'm still in the early stages of designing item blueprints, I'm thinking of doing something very drastic with item property costs for my PW and want some input.

I'm trying to keep the item costs as close to the PHB and DMG as possible, but it seems nearly impossible to do so given the current formulas and cost Bioware uses. Therefore, I'm considering wiping them completely (i.e. setting all iprp 2da costs to 0) and using just the "Additional Cost" property to set the item cost.

I'm pretty certain though that there is something I'm overlooking and really need some input...

What are the costs of standard PNP stuff?

BioWare's standard math check is: [Base Cost(baseitems.2da)+

1000x((multiplierxmodifier)^2)+SpellCosts(multiplierxmodifier)]

xMaxStack(baseitems.2DA)xBaseMultiplier(baseitems.2DA) + Additional Cost

Given this you should be able to manipulate value as you see fit without too much issue. For instance manipulating the maxstack/basemultiplier value could let you reduce the totality of the values to the point it reaches your goal through simple division(like basemultiplier of 0.01 divides the entire value by 100).

ALL of the item value .2DA's can be changed without requiring a hak for the players.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Ravine_HU]

               Hi,
there are hak's for this, the best i found is even's 3.5 edition:
http://nwvault.ign.c....Detail&id=5646

It contains lots of stuffs, including complete itemproperties rebalance (which are simply modified 2da's).
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_ffbj]

               Highv Priest:  Which script is it that contains that calculation?