Adding challenge for Sorcerers & Wizards

[Legacy_EzRemake]

               Hello everyone,

I'm currently working on an Action PW, and the balance and difficulty progression I have set up thus far is working as intended, except for one small problem, high magic classes such as Sorcerers and Wizards whip through it all effortlessly.

I'm aware it's just the nature of this game that these two classes are very powerful by default, but I'm curious how I can go about adding a little more challenge to these types, without making it even harder on other classes that already have it hard enough.

As it stand now, I'm really only worried about adjusting the difficulty for magic users about level 18 or so. Currently all monsters between levels 20 and 30 have have 20 spell resistance, but even that seems to get pierced pretty effortlessly.

Any tips in this area would be great, thanks alot everyone!
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Eagles Talon]

               2 words - Wild Magic
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Dark Defiance]

               Yes, as Eagles Talon said, Wild Magic or "Spells gone wild!" is a fun twist. While I'm no expert in the sorcery department myself, these are some tips:

-You can always make "battlemage" type NPCs, and tweak their spell lists and give them a sword.
-You can also manipulate the npc's saving throws to best some spells.
-Multiple copies of npcs/creatures with different stats. Mages will never know who they are going up against and can't easily prepare for a given area.
-Remember that a mages bane is close combat.

-DD
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_SHOVA]

               Give specific spell immunities, to varrious creatures. use your on spawn script, to give the creature a immunity item, have it equip it, but don't let it drop it on death. That way your players will never know what immunity is going ot show up.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Shadooow]

               I really wonder, in most action PWs casters at higher level sucks, they can use only damage shields, nothing else works...

Most action PWs using these methods to do it:

1) high saves
- makes a caster to use only spells without save -> IGMS and damage shields

2) (improved) evasion
- even if saves are low, if creature has evasion then 90% offensive spells won't work

3) magic damage resist (5,10) or magic damage immunity
- will make IGMS useless

4) specific immunity (igms, implosion, anything else)

5) soak 50/+1
- will soak spells that does physical damage - blade barrier, creeping doom

6) acid and fire damage resist (30-50) or immunity
- to prevent the most lame tactic with damage shields

7) +5 weapons
- all protection spells will be useless except epic warding

+20 weapons
- to pierce even epic warding

9) beholder dispells

10) restricted rest

11) spell balance changes in module

combining these methods you can reach what you want, but that depends on how are dungeons build in your module, if its classic stupid dungeon with one or two different creatures and nothing more then you won't be successfull much. In that case you will make with these methods rather non-caster dungeon.
               
               

               

                     Modifié par ShaDoOoW, 21 mars 2011 - 08:50 .
                     
                  

            

[Legacy_EzRemake]

               I think I have a fair grasp of how I am going to do it now, however won't be incorporating Wild Magic or anything of that sort. The one thing that needed a drastic improvement from what I saw was saves, so certain monsters above specific levels have had their universals adjusted.

I figure I should for the most part let wizards and such have their fun mid levels, because I could understand how they could simmer down in the higher levels, especially versus level 50-60 mobs for instance.
               
               

               
            

[Legacy_Xovian]

               Keep in mind also that some types of creatures are "universally" difficult regardless of class.
Constructs come to mind in this regard, especially those built with the idea that they have a specific weakness, but that is their only weakness. Even the OC of NWN used this technique in one area of the game.

Another thing I can recommend is Claduep's Random properties on the vault.
You can customize it in many ways, and it will keep encounters and such random in how the mobs appear. You'll never have them be the exact same, and depending on how you tweak it, you can make things completely random, or very specific for any given creature. So it's something worth considering.

My recent (mostly finished) training module uses that system, and it keeps things interesting for all characters.